Episode 262 | Family Unity After Dis-Unity - Group Discussion (Part II)

Some church experiences do not just disappoint you, they break trust, split families, and leave you questioning whether God is safe. We name that reality head-on and talk with men who have been through spiritual abuse, control, and the kind of legalism that turns “church” into a system of fear. The goal is not to stir up drama, but to help wounded people separate what people did from who God is and to show a path forward that is rooted in Jesus Christ, not in a personality or a power structure.

We dig into how man rule actually happens in a cult-like church: it usually starts with small concessions driven by a need to belong, then grows into endless rules, twisted Bible quotes, and pressure to treat leaders as your conscience. We also talk about the cost of that system, including trauma, isolation, and the devastation of shunning. Along the way, we keep coming back to a simple question you can ask yourself anytime: who am I following right now, man or God?

From there, we get practical about recovery and spiritual discernment: being born again, staying sensitive to the Holy Spirit, testing teachings against Scripture, and finding a gathering that truly preaches salvation rather than control. We also address family division with honesty, including why reconciliation is not always possible without surrendering conviction. If you need hope after church hurt, this is a clear, compassionate conversation that points back to the Word, the Spirit, and a sincere prayer life. Subscribe, share with someone who needs it, and leave a review, what part of this conversation hit closest to home?

Visit us online: https://woundedheartswoundedchurches.com

Transcript

Welcome And Guest Introductions

Speaker 2 0:13

We're standing again today's video program.

Prince Moon 1:05

There's been a lot of those who've hurt and those who've been hurt want to reach out to those that yeah you can make it. In fact, our guests here tonight, glad they're here. They've been through the ringer, so to speak, but yet they're here tonight encouraged reaching out to others, showing that whatever you went through, church issues, whatever it's been, God, not man, God can bring you through. So we're here for unity of God's people. Our first guest is Brother Benny Tahoke. Renny Tahoke, father, grandfather, husband. Been the church of God for years and years. He's an accomplished author. He has an exciting book called Torn Asunder. I read it. I have a copy of it. It's an excellent read, it really is. I enjoyed reading it. I read it in about a day and a half. So we're glad he's here tonight to join with us in this important discussion. Also, Dan Anderson's in Transit. We're looking for him to maybe uh chime in. He is uh traveling today, though, but we're happy to have him a part of this, at least in spirit. He's a content creator, exciting program he has called Unshackled Cults and False Religions. And he's and he's on many of the platforms, also, too. A lot of work he does in music and in content, and does a good job of that. Also, we have tonight our co-host, James de Grafenreed. I like that name, don't you? Listen, he's called James de Grafenreed. That's a nice one. But anyway, we're glad he's here tonight. He's a father, a husband, grandfather, and he also has some content on the internet and programs, planning a church there in Tennessee. So we're glad they're here tonight. Also, our engineer Tanil McLeod in the Atlanta area. She does the technical part of this program and also the artwork and founder of Arise Magazine. I'm Prince Moon, licensed counselor, founder of Antioch Youth Center, retired. So to our guests, give them a hand. We're glad that you're tonight to be with us.

When Church Hurt Turns Traumatic

Prince Moon 3:12

Brother Bernie, do you have any more comments about your pictorials from last week?

Bernie Tocholke 3:18

Uh yes, I brought them with here. And the last episode there, we were talking about uh uh all the negative aspects or trademarks of a church that is man-made. All right. It doesn't matter what the name of the church is or whatever, like that, but I wanted to talk more about God's church. The thing that burdens me the most this week is about the hurt that has taken place across the country. People that have been in a cult or been in a church that was abused, and that's what the urgency is to validate. Well, you don't know what you're talking about. Well, okay, just to validate, not to lift me up or anything like that. I spent a year of my life in jail of something I couldn't control. The cult wanted to tear me down, wanted me come back crying to to cater to them. And um, I lost the home, I lost vehicles, I lost, I basically became homeless. Uh last time I came out of jail, I think it was the last time because I spent a three-month, a three-month, and a six-month. I can't remember which one it was exactly. I came out middle of the night, they won't let you out at midnight because you can run to the bars one in the morning. Um got out. I came into uh uh the court hearing in the summertime. I had a short sleeve shirt on, and uh when I got released, it was December, just before Christmas, and I was basically homeless. And uh I tried to find a warm place, went to the filling station, and uh, what are you uh how can I help you? I said, No, I'm just waiting for the for daylight. No, you can't loiter here, you can't solicit here. Okay, and called the cops. Cops came. What's the problem? I says, I I live in Minnesota, this is in Kenosha, Wisconsin. Um, do you know where the jail is? Yeah, you can sleep there for the night. And so, why was I released from uh jail at one in the morning? And it was like 15, 20 degrees at that time. So I got to the jail, got through the first door. They wouldn't let me through the second door. So here I'm a corridor of 20 feet wide, maybe uh 10 foot long, whatever, in a place, uh concrete tile, tile on the floor, cold. It was warmer than outside, but uh, so I slept on the floor there like a dog, didn't even get a blanket, nothing. At least a dog would get a blanket, get a cushion. So I've been through it. There's other people that have gone through a lot worse than me, me, and they've lost their homes. They gave their money all to the church, sold their homes, did this, uh, got uh told that they were ugly, that uh glad they're gone, you know. People got abused by certain cults. And uh, I'm talking about the church got restoration, but just devastated, pulled the carpet out from underneath them, lost the family because you uh the child doesn't want to go with the system. The parents are supposed to shun them and so forth. So, how do you help somebody like that look for God, get uh have uh you know, forgiveness, forgiveness even if they're not asking for it, but seek God because the time is short. You don't know how long you have on this earth. It might be tomorrow, it might be uh 30 years from now, 50 years from now, but that is the most important. If uh if you lose a little money, yeah, you lost a little bit. You make the wrong decision and uh for a marital uh partner, you you messed up your life. But if you make a wrong decision for your eternal soul, you can mess it up for eternity. You have to be right there, and so seek God, seek God, be in God's church, be with the spirit and in truth, and just forget humans around you in a sense that they are not your guardian, they are not, but gain help from them if you can, if you have the right spirit, if they have the right spirit, uh seek uh a church, a gathering, something like maybe a small Bible study, something like that, but crave to be with uh uh same-minded individuals that are true from God that have proof for their service, not you can't do it on your own. That's true, you can, but it's extremely difficult. Seek other members, seek constantly to propagate the name of Jesus. So uh get stronger in that. Seek the Bible listen, you know, don't elevate a human being.

Prince Moon 7:52

Brother James, any comments?

Why Man Made Religion Grows

James DeGraffenreid 7:56

God's word tells us that we're gonna be living in perilous times. We've said before, Brother Moon, that this is our time. God has allowed us to be here, to be alive in this uh in this time of the dispensation of grace. God has provided a savior. God has provided a way that we can be forgiven, that we can be saved. There's no other name given among men whereby we must be saved. We have to come to God in his time and in his uh way when the Holy Spirit draws us and leads us to him. That's the time that we must receive the free gift that God gave in Christ when He uh shed his blood on Calvary's tree. That is my only hope, Brother Moon, is that I have Jesus' blood uh applied to my life, and that the sins that I've committed against the holy God have been forgiven, not because of me, but because of the mercy of God in Christ Jesus. Now we've talked about how simple this is, it's not complicated. Man complicates uh the gospel. Man adds to and takes away from the gospel that Jesus gave. So, brother, it's very simple. As brother Bernie says, There have been many people who've been hurt, uh and those hurts are real.

Prince Moon 9:49

Yes, they are traumatic.

James DeGraffenreid 9:52

The enemy has a purpose in uh these different scenarios that we've talked about. As you've said, Brother Moon, it's a miracle that dear brother Bernie is not bitter today because of what was done to him. True, true, but by but by the grace of God, he's a child of God, and he's sharing the gospel of Christ. Um he has that burden, he has that heart. And every every child of God has that heart, brother. You you can't just go to one service and be entertained for an hour on Sunday and think that you're a Christian. It doesn't work that way. Jesus said, if you would follow me, take up your cross daily. Take up your cross daily and follow me.

The Slow Slide Into Man Rule

Prince Moon 10:46

Well, Jeff, I got a question for you. I hate to interrupt you, but our time's against us, and I really want to draw from you guys. I take what you're saying sincerely because of what you all have been through. So, again, question for both of our guests tonight: how does one shift from being God rule to man rule? How does one shift from being God rule to man rule? Give me some advice, help me out. Who wants to go first? Bernie, brother James?

Bernie Tocholke 11:12

Okay. Um, it started out uh if you have a desire to be belonging, that's a danger. That's a danger to start out with. That if you want to be part of them, you start doing things that are a little minor. It doesn't start out, you don't jump in boiling hot water like the frog episode there. It's it's small things. Uh, okay, fine, I'll button my top button, you know, just to be part of your group. And oh yeah, I'm I'm gonna do this. And oh, I got stripes in this shirt in this shirt. Oh, that's wrong. It should be solid color. Uh it's not much, you know, but you kind of go with it, and and pretty soon you can't do this, and you can't do that, and and and pretty soon you got so many laws and rules, and all of a sudden, you know what happened? It got lukewarm, pretty soon got hotter and hotter and hotter, and now it's time to jump. And I tell my wife, I'd like to move back up north again. Well, there's nothing up there. Well, she's caught up in it. Well, I still like to go. Well, I'm not leaving, so now you got a problem. You're caught, you're caught in this rat trap of uh legalism, of cultism, and you can't leave. And pretty soon she leaves you and moves into the pastor. So, in the same household there. So, yeah, there was a lot of things that went down, and that's how you can just evolve into it and all of a sudden become a demand rule. How do you get out of it? Well, for me, the carpet got ripped out underneath it, me, I got thrown in jail. I wrongfully she lied about things, and I got put in the jail, there was no truth whatsoever in it, and and uh uh how do you get out of it? It I was bitter, it took a little bit to get out of it, but uh after seeking God, and God was as faith very faithful to me, and finally it becomes uh you know, finally forgive them for what they did and seeking God, and God brought the clarity in my heart and my mind and stuff to be able to seek Him, seek Him. If I go to a local church, if they're preaching salvation, okay, I can get fed. If they do not preach salvation, move on, find somewhere where to preach salvation. It's not the name on the door, it's the name on the heart. The name on the heart is what's important, and so if they have salvation, if they're they're speaking salvation, speaking Christ, Christ is the one that you need to follow, not man, then you're on the right track. And just get the feed that you can, and anything that's different, it's like a buffet. You don't have to take everything down that's on the buffet, but eat what's available, eat what's good for you.

Prince Moon 13:54

So James, any thoughts on that?

James DeGraffenreid 13:58

Well, to answer your question, Brother Moon, how does it happen? I believe it would be right to say that there's something in man we read about the children of Israel came out of Egypt. God delivered them out of from the hand of Pharaoh with a mighty hand. God blessed them and brought them uh to a place of freedom and it was just a short time, and they were worshiping a golden calf made by man. There it is there's something in man uh that as Bernie says uh well if we're not careful we will let a man uh or a group of men uh determine what we believe and what we do. And we've said about we talked about this before on this podcast with you, Brother Moon. The greatest evil, uh the greatest harm, the greatest damage that the that the COGR has done. Again, we speak about the Church of God restoration because Bernie and I were a part of that. We know what we went through, we know about it firsthand. The greatest evil was these evil uh men who have been leading it, the apostles and the ministry there has required the people to put their faith and trust in them and follow their rules. In order to do that, Brother Moon, a person has to turn away from Christ and turn to man. And that becomes an idol to that person and they they they lose if they did have a close walk with Christ, they lose that and they begin following man and doing what man says to do as brother.

Prince Moon 16:01

And so and so we can't follow both, can we?

James DeGraffenreid 16:04

We can't, we can't, brother. Jesus said you can't serve God and mammoth. You can't, you can't, there's no way. God, God won't allow it. He's a jealous God, brother Moon. He's not gonna give his place to any other. And if we can receive what he gives us in Christ and hold to that and cling to that, and let Jesus be our guide, let the word we have to we have two witnesses, brother. Come on, this is church of God doctrine. We have two witnesses that God has given us.

Prince Moon 16:40

That's true.

James DeGraffenreid 16:42

The word and the spirit.

Prince Moon 16:43

That's true.

James DeGraffenreid 16:44

And if we if we don't let the word and the spirit be our God and let us be what God has called us to be, brother, we're lost. I don't care what we go by. We can be on a hundred rolls of man, we can join every denomination of man that has been made, but we're gonna be lost without Brother James.

Prince Moon 17:07

Ask, ask us, say who are we following? Who on an individual basis tonight? Ask us, who are we following? Are we following man or are we following God?

James DeGraffenreid 17:19

Amen, brother. It's that simple.

Prince Moon 17:22

I hate to interrupt you, but uh expand on that. How do I follow the word and the spirit? What do I do? How can I follow the word and the spirit? What do I do? How can I do that?

James DeGraffenreid 17:32

All right, we'll we'll we'll try our best to to to to explain.

Prince Moon 17:37

And we'll come to next Bernie about the same question in just one moment, but go right ahead.

James DeGraffenreid 17:42

Nicodemus came to Christ and said, We know you're a teacher, we know you're from God, and Jesus told Nicodemus, Ye must be born again. All right, God has made a way that we can be saved. Every child of God has been born of the Spirit of God. And what happens, dear Brother Moon, in so many cases in places that are not the true church of God that we're talking about uh worshiping God in spirit and truth, uh that baby in Christ, instead of uh growing in grace and in the knowledge of our Lord and Savior, instead of walking in the light that the Holy Spirit leads in, instead of keeping that close, intimate uh uh walk with the Lord, where when you read the word, you hear Jesus talking

Walking By The Word And Spirit

James DeGraffenreid 18:48

to your heart. And you and you're and the person not becomes not sensitive to the dealings of the Holy Spirit, just as the Holy Spirit drew you to a place of repentance, we need that close walk with the Lord every every day of our spiritual life. And if we if we lose that, if it becomes just a form, if we get settled in our ways, see that's what the devil has done, brother. The devil has more ways now than he's ever had to try to get people's attention away from following Christ and being sensitive to the dealings of the Holy Spirit. You look everywhere you look, every look, brother. We don't need we look, we're gonna be we don't beat around the bush, brother. Everything, everything on television is is is designed to program your mind away from being close to Jesus, brother James.

Prince Moon 19:53

We gotta take a break. Brother Bernie, you'll be next. Gotta break. Sorry to do that, but we'll be right back. Best is yet to come. Brother Bernie, how do I walk with the spirit in the word? What should I do? What are my first steps on that?

Bernie Tocholke 21:24

Okay, if there's a pastor, let's say uh Pat, Pastor Pat uh is preaching from the pulpit because I was working too much. I was working six days a week trying to pay for seven children and going to every single required camp meeting. It doesn't matter if it's in Oklahoma or if it's in California or wherever it is, Ohio, I gotta go, I gotta go, I gotta go, and so it takes a lot of money. And he said, out of the pulpit. He mentioned about uh that uh it is not right, it's not godly, you should work five days a week, spend the sixth day with your family, and seventh day in the church. Now, if you do not know scripture, you're not in scripture, how do you fight against that? Do you just accept that? Do you just follow that man, or do you follow God? What does God say about it? Is he smarter now than God? God did the earth and the world in six days. Pastor Pat wants to do it in five. He's smarter than God. You know, another thing he said one time, he mentioned about obesity. He says, Take, and he's preaching in the pulpit, behind the pulpit, so it's supposed to be the word of God. He says, the Bible says you're supposed to cut your throat if you give into appetite. I didn't have the courage to stand up right there and say, okay, hold it, hold it, Pastor. Where does it say that? Well, in Proverbs, it says what it says, put a knife to your throat. Pastor, I'll put a knife to my throat and I'll consider obesity. It's a serious thought. And you cut your throat, like you say the scripture says, you add it to scripture, you cut your throat and see which one comes out right. You know, you gotta know the word. You gotta know what the Bible teaches. And don't exaggerate. Pull it this way and pull it that way until you suit your own personal vendetta of some sort. You have to know the scripture. Look into the word and reason. If it's of God, do it. If it's uh uh, you know, like uh uh like I mentioned to my children, you're supposed to respect your parents. It says in the word, your parents in the word, respect them in the word. You are not in the word or uh in the church, and so therefore they didn't have to respect me. It's a twisted scripture, and so you got to know the scripture, get into the Bible, know what you're talking about, and uh every every person in the world loves God. How do you fight against that? Everybody they just have different names for it, and some serve different names. Well, do you know the scripture enough that I am the way, the truth, and the life? No man comes to the father but by me. If you don't have a have that in Jesus Christ, your trust in Jesus Christ, your soul safe with Jesus Christ's blood, you cannot come to the Father. Do you know the scripture enough for that? So seek God. Seek God, seek the Bible, know whatever it's at, and then listen. Listen to the uh the Spirit of God. That's the way I would say how to fight against being man-ruled.

Prince Moon 24:43

Brother James, you mentioned a couple of things about walking in the spirit. You said to walk in the light as God has shown you, to be close to God and follow him. Expand on that, please, Brother James. You mentioned that earlier.

James DeGraffenreid 24:57

Well, there's no substitute for that, brother. We if we have that, if we have what Brother Bernie's just described, then we are a child of God. And and and every promise of God is for his child. If we don't have that, if if we're not doing what dear brother Bernie just described, we're not we're not a child of God. See, here's the deal, brother Moon. Like we said before, it's it's in man. There's something about man in man, in the nature of man, that uh settles for less than what God says or what God's will is. Uh go back go all the way back to the to the Garden of Eden with with Adam and Eve. God made it very clear to Adam what he was to do and what he wasn't to do. It wasn't complicated, it was very simple. And Adam didn't do what the Lord told him to do, and he brought spiritual death upon all man. So it it it's it's not complicated. Uh, we've talked about the sin unto death, we've talked about that before. If we fail to let God have his place in our heart, we're gonna be lost. It's that simple, brother. Um, and I as I said, every child of God knows we all you know in in Revelation it says they, the redeemed, overcame the enemy by the blood of the Lamb, by the word of their testimony, and they love not their lives unto the death. Brother, we have to be saved, we have to come to Christ, his blood has to wash our sins away, and then we have to have a testimony as we have here on Wounded Hearts, uh, wounded churches, brother. The devil tries to take a child of God's testimony away. Yes, and if we let the enemy get us so caught up in the things of this world, we'll be lost, brother. That's why the devil tries so hard to get us to uh stop uh being sensitive to the word of God and the spirit of God. It's not complicated. Look, brother Moon, I don't need to tell you what it means to be sensitive to the dealings of the Holy Spirit and to be faithful to the word of God as God shows you and helps you to understand. He does that to every child of God, every child of God, and that's what as Brother Bernie has shared tonight. The church of God is uh is God's church, the bride of Christ. God's children worship God in spirit and truth. That's it's that simple. And every child of God knows, brother, we know when the Holy Spirit, it's like Jesus said, the Spirit of God is like the wind. We don't know where it came from before it came to us, and we don't know where it goes after, but we know when the Holy Ghost convicts us of our need of a savior, amen. And and we know whenever the Holy Spirit deals with us, so you shouldn't do that. And we're gonna do one of two things. It goes back to the choice that you spoke about earlier. God made us, He made Adam and gave him a free will to choose, and that free will is in every man. We have to make choices, brother. And it it depends on what choices we make, whether we're going to be saved or whether we're gonna be lost.

Prince Moon 29:05

Beautiful thought. Another question I have for both of our panelists tonight. We know that division does split up families sometimes. If I'm facing that challenge, families split up, children. There's a split there between mom and dad, or mom and children. What can I do to try to bring that family back together again? We'll take Brother James first, then Brother Bernie second, if we could please.

James DeGraffenreid 29:37

Well, in my case, Brother Bo, the Lord knows my heart. I I prayed uh when my children were little, I would bow at their bed and pray with them each night. My prayer was, Lord, help my family to be saved. I'm alone now, brother. None of my family's saved. All I can do right now is be faithful to the Lord and trust God that He's hearing my prayer for my family, that that the Lord will work to try to help them, to try to try

Family Splits And Hard Convictions

James DeGraffenreid 30:17

to deal with them and help them to come to a place of repentance. Uh, you know, we like we've talked about reconciliation. Sometimes, sometimes there's not going to be reconciliation, brother Bose.

Prince Moon 30:32

That's that's true. That's very true.

James DeGraffenreid 30:35

Because when when a person gives their heart to Christ, and this is biblical now. What what we're talking about tonight, we're not making this up.

Prince Moon 30:42

It's very serious and very and very emotional for for all of us. That's very true.

James DeGraffenreid 30:47

It's simple. When when we become a child of God, we become separate from the world. And the sad reality is, brother, I don't know if you read Pilgrim's Progress, but John Bunyan, he he he he really he wrote a beautiful allegory of the Christian walk. Uh brother, the sad reality is, and and brother, I'm just being honest. Many many times, and in fact, we would even say most of the time, a person's family is not going to follow them. They may be the only one. And you know, that's scriptural too. God said, one of one of a family or two of a family. Uh look, it's not my call, it's not your call, it's not man's call. Uh it's God's call. It's God that chooses to deal with every heart, and it's it's that person's choice whether they receive the free gift that God has given in Christ Jesus.

Prince Moon 31:53

Brother James, when you talk to your son or your family, how is that going on when you talk to him? Are you all communicating pretty good? You you and your son or daughter?

James DeGraffenreid 32:02

Well, brother, it's been an up and down. Uh there have been times when I've been estranged and not been able to talk to them. Uh, right now, I'm thankful I'm able to talk to them, and uh, they see my life. Uh here's the deal, brother. Um it God requires us uh to be faithful to what he's showing us, what he's told us. And each like we've talked before, everyone has an individual walk with Christ. You may be further along in your walk, and you may understand more than I do. God requires you to be faithful to what God, what he's laid on your heart. I have convictions that I gave to God, but I don't require anybody else to have my convictions, but God requires me to be faithful to that which I've given to him. If I've laid it on the altar to the Lord, I can't let man tell me, oh, you don't need to do that. If I listen to man, instead of listening to the dealings of the Holy Spirit and walking in the light that Christ shines in my path, I'm gonna be lost, brother. I'm gonna lose that relationship with God, the Father.

Prince Moon 33:22

That's true. Brother Bernie, I want to come to you about family issues, your daughters, etc. I know it's emotional for you. You can pass on the question if you wish, but we just want to know how you've worked through family issues since all that you've been through. What should we do?

Bernie Tocholke 33:38

First, I want to start out with something that uh uh Brother James mentioned about Pilgrim's Progress. That is one fictitious story. Why? How many times did he go through the valley of despair? Once. And how many times do we go through it? We're in and out, in and out throughout life, and so I mean it as sarcasm and uh comedy in a sense that yes, uh Pilgrim's progress. That uh Christian there went through a lot of things. Okay, now get back to the question as far as uh reconciliation for family, daughters, granddaughters, ex-wife, that type of thing. Um 30 years ago, I believed you can love them, love them into you know reconciliation. I don't believe that anymore. You can give 100%, and if they're 100% against you, there's nothing you can do about it. They are gone, they will not. Uh, the only way is if you give up on God, what he has showed you on your convictions, you know, the what I shared last week there on the spirit and truth. If you give up on that idea and believe that the church of God restoration is right, oh, then you can have them back. But unless you don't do that, if you don't do that, no, you can't have them. It's absolutely gone. So you basically have to stick your convictions, you have to put Christ above that. And if it works out, fine. There was a time when I couldn't see my daughter or my granddaughter for four years.

Prince Moon 35:05

But how's it going now? How is that going now?

Bernie Tocholke 35:07

It's going better, it's going good. We we exchanged texts every now and then and stuff like that. Uh, she knows where I stand, I know where she stands, I believe. But as the church has fallen, their cult has fallen apart. I don't exactly know where she stands right now. She might be sliding away from them too. I don't know. But I love my daughter and my granddaughter, and uh if they needed me tomorrow, I I'd do what I could to shut down the business here and head that way down in the hot hot Ohio or Indiana or whatever. I'd I'd I'd do what I could. So no, I uh I no longer believe that you can love them to wild expression, love them to death, you know, that type of thing. Um my ex-wife, um, after as a divorce was going on, I want my old pillow back. Instead of getting old pillows back, I bought a brand new one. And nice ones. Uh, I like to have my frying pants. Well, I went ahead and bought brand new ones. And this continued for a little while, the blankets or whatever. She she wanted some articles, you know. You can have it all, you can have it all. Just take it, just take it, you know. And and uh until my two sons that came with me says, Dan, why are you wasting your money? It will never happen. She's stuck in that system, she's stuck with their mentality that they are right, there's nothing you can do. So is there reconciliation? No, not always. There's sometimes that they're stuck in their ways four years for my daughter, but now it's good. Um I have a good relationship with seven of my children, basically.

Prince Moon 36:39

Beautiful situation, brother James. In our conclusion, give an altar call, Brother James, to someone. Maybe they've been hurt, maybe they're not saved. Give an altar call tonight.

James DeGraffenreid 36:49

Well, dear brother, we have talked tonight about God's way, God's plan. Uh he he offers Jesus said, Behold, I stand at the door and knock. If anyone opens the door, I'll come in to him and sup with him, and he with me. God has made a way that that that we can be his child. God has made a way that our sins can be forgiven. And God's word says when he forgives us, he doesn't remember those sins against us ever again. Brother, the Lord loves us, the Lord loves every soul. The Bible says it's not God's will that anyone should perish, but that all should come to repentance. That call goes out tonight, brother Moon. That call goes out through throughout the world tonight. Anyone who's listening to this podcast tonight, please know that your father in heaven loves you. Know that he knows that there was no way you could be right. We couldn't save ourselves.

Altar Call And Final Encouragement

James DeGraffenreid 38:02

He made a way through Christ Jesus, the the blood that Jesus shed on Calvary's tree, he made a way that you can be saved tonight. And I encourage you, if the Holy Spirit of God is dealing with your heart, you you bow your head, you you bow your knees, and you talk to the Lord about it. Just tell him, Lord, I've offended you. Lord, I realize you died for me. I realize you made a way that I can be forgiven. Father, I'm receiving that which Jesus did for me. I'm asking you to save me. I'm asking you to make me your child. Lord, I'll live for you. I'll turn away from my own ways, and I'll follow you. Lord, whatever you want, Lord, I'll be your child. Brother, that's what that's what God requires, Brother Moon. And we we we offer that invitation tonight. Any anyone in the in the sound of our voice and in hearing this podcast, please, if the Lord's Holy Spirit is dealing with you, you take the out that God's giving you. Don't don't don't harden your heart. Be sensitive to the dealings of the Holy Spirit.

Prince Moon 39:20

Beautiful. Brother Bernie, someone's going through tonight some tough situations. What should they do? Any help, any advice for them?

Bernie Tocholke 39:28

Have a sincere prayer, sincerity. Just cry out to God with your deepest, deepest feelings. That God, please save this individual. Me, I have gone wrong, I have gone astray. You know, just cry out to God, please help me to get back on a straight path and uh make it right with God. And God will answer. He is faithful at that. If your prayer is sincere, God can read your heart, God can read your soul, he will give you new life, and just seek him, just seek him. And uh the time is short. I mean, a hundred years can go by, and it's so short compared to eternity. So short. That's true. If we put it on a graph, a long graph, two lines, if we put a line on the end, that that line is way too thick. I mean, a pencil line is way too thick for the short hundred years that we have here. So make it right with God, make it right with Jesus, and uh see you in eternity. See you in heaven.

Prince Moon 40:34

Should I do that right now, tonight?

James DeGraffenreid 40:35

Yes, amen.

Prince Moon 40:37

Yeah, don't let me.

James DeGraffenreid 40:38

See, brother, brother Moon, that's a mistake that a lot of people make. They they they believe they can come to God when they want to, and in their own way. And we we have to come God's way, and we have to come whenever the Holy Spirit draws us. We can't just come to God on our own terms when we want to. A lot of people think they can. Some people say, Well, I'll wait till I'm on my deathbed. Well, no, you may not do anything but die on your deathbed. We have to come to God when the Holy Spirit draws us, and we have to come in God's way. We have to receive Jesus and and accept what he did for us. Brother, that's all I have. That's the only hope I have, Brother Moon. When I stand before my Father at that great white throne judgment, all I have, all I hope for is that Jesus will say, He's mine. My blood has covered his sins. Yeah. That's all I have a hope for because I, brother, I can I can't merit it. I'm I there's no way that I could be saved if Jesus had not done what he did for me.

Prince Moon 42:02

Well, dear one, we're here tonight with our friends, and we're letting you know that they've been through tumultuous situations, but God has brought them through. They're encouraged, they have podcast programs, they're exhorting and going on for God. And if they can, you can too. That's right. What they've been through has been momentous, and so their advice is to keep going for God, walk in the Spirit, and follow Him. And if it works for them, it can work for you. My friends, thank you so much. Been very emotional, but it's been true. That has been your reality, what God did for you, and that helps us. Well, thank you again, Brother James, Brother Bernie. We love you much. To our engineer, thank you so much, and those who listen tonight. May the Lord bless you.